Arne K Lund

Hinduism,Cristianity and other religions.

Tuesday, June 12, 2007 8:09:18 PM

hinduism, christianity, religion, politics

Dear friends, and especially my indian friends. Lately I have been thinking about the words "rice - christians", meaning people that become christians because they gain something by it, an not because they believe christianity is more true than their old religion. In norwegian papers there has been a small discussion of this. Especially people from the lowest cast, the "untouchables" becoming christians (and a few becoming muslims) en masse, because this is the only way to "move upwards" for them in the indian society. I know that the laws do not permit discrimination due to cast, race etc. And that real measures has been taken to put this laws into effect.
I am an admirer of Mahatma (the great spirit) Gandhi. As a true hindu he fought against this discrimination in words and deeds. But to day I am afraid that the more intolerant groups of hinduism is on the march forward. (Like I fear intolerant groups in the "Christian west" and many muslim countries).
I do not prefer an all tolerant world religion, that necessarily will be very intolerant on anybody that is not tolerant in its specially defined way. (I see a lot of it already). I trust the good in man and fear the evil in him.
Dear friends. What is your meaning?

My first blogLIFE AND LOVE,RELIGIONS AND TOLERANCE.

Comments

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Claudette claudette.bb # Sunday, June 17, 2007 8:15:43 PM

You are already off to a great start blogging

King NutinKingnutin # Sunday, June 17, 2007 8:57:06 PM

So True....thats the problem when religion scriptures aren't specific, leading to many versions of the same phrase, leading to Extremism.

In India, the society is generally conservative, so whatever is passed off as tradition is stictly followed by the uneducated. Thats why casteism and other social evils are generally accepted without questioning. I think that only education can break these bonds.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:24:00 AM

I agree with you Kingnutin, that education is very important.

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Wednesday, July 4, 2007 7:31:01 AM

yes, as painful and self-exerting a job it may be... we all must read. but the search for truth is bound up in literacy.
that's not to say that enlightenment can not be achieved without education.
sometimes i wish i didn't have to deal with so many nuances and doctrines.

aVavheretic # Thursday, July 5, 2007 12:29:44 PM

" I know that the laws do not permit discrimination due to cast, race etc." -- if Indian law is anything to go by then they substitute outright discrimination with a more subtle easy process for those 'fortunate' enough to be discrimated upon.

Aniruddhakavishwar # Thursday, August 2, 2007 10:46:55 PM

To me every religion speaks about the humanity and the betterment of the mankind. It works more on mindwaves than the physical or materialistic desires. It satisfies the quench in search for the real happiness. The problem starts when tiere is a strong desire for the supremacy over the others by way of domination.Whatever situation about the discrimination is a related problem to financial and political independance than the religious. A true follower of any religion is always polite and tolarent. Whether he is so called educated or not . Tell me what is the meaning of education ? Aniruddha

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Friday, August 3, 2007 6:12:04 PM

Tank u for your comment. With education I do not mean any formal education. As a teacher, and a social worker I see the value of formal education, but as a christian I mean: the folowing after Christ, in deeds including words. A dicipleship. I think any man or woman who really search for truth, love and tolerance, whatever his religion, is following Christ, as I think Gandhiji did.
I also agree that there is a real problem in any religion, when there is any desire for the supremacy of others. That is just the reason why I think that truth is not a religion, a doctrine of policy, science etc. but a living person.
I know that also this has been misused, and is beeing misused, time over and over again. That's just why I think persons like Gandhiji, Nelson Mandela and st. Franz av Asissi( ,who looked upon life in a very Hindu way), and many other living and dead men and women can help us so that we do not misuse truth.
(Ps. I would say spiritual way instead of mindwaves, but that is not important Ds.)

Would u like to be my friend Kavishwar?

Aniruddhakavishwar # Friday, August 3, 2007 9:59:05 PM

It is my pleasure sir !

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Saturday, August 11, 2007 7:00:38 PM

Last evening my wife and I saw the Indian comedy Large Raho Munnabhai on Norwegian television. We both enjoyed the film, and the clear reference to Gandhiji and his teaching as a positive teaching for all men

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Monday, August 13, 2007 6:18:00 PM

I think every religion was made to give hope and tell people how to be a better human. But there are always some people, who get it wrong. The problem of fundamentalism can be found in any religion. Some people just don't think about it and kill others in the name of their god or gods. But every religion tells that you shouldn't harm anybody.

Imagine if you where god. You'd see people killing eachother. Your childs, your creations fight against eachother. I'd get a headache, like I get, when I'm watching/reading the News...

Sorry for my bad english.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Monday, August 13, 2007 8:41:10 PM

You are right. The troubble is that it is so easy to get it wrong

Ps As a norwegian I have no troubble with your english. It's perfect Ds.
Will u b my friend?

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Monday, August 13, 2007 8:41:56 PM

Add me

Edit: Oh you did. Me too.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Monday, August 13, 2007 8:44:19 PM

You are faaaaast

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Monday, August 13, 2007 8:46:37 PM

You too

I use the Opera side panel. Just clicked on it and then I saw this comment.

Safss_ali # Monday, August 20, 2007 12:17:15 AM

Today I had an angry arguement with my younger cousin. He claims to be agnostic and i believing in God. I guess we were both upset, but at the end he's still my cousin and we still hv luv for each other so it was all kool.

I like a 'religious tolerance' idea. However I believe in 'religious respect' even more. That is wht Canada promotes under multi-culturalism and diversity.

Tradition and Rituals without understanding meaning are useless, and a person should re-evaluate whether they're following their religion or just trying to be part of whtever the community does (Teh H4mst0R has made me re-evaluate after watching Zeitgest...I don't know if I should be thankful to him or be angry at him

). But if u know why or wht u're doing then u r better for it.

In India they're facing a crisis of following traditions tht is denounced by the govt. However traditionalists(like everywhere else) become rigid (dismissing Mahatma's tolerance) and don't let go of the Caste system, dowry and femal foeticide.

Let's hope for the best.

Can't believe u've watched Lage Raho Munnabhai!!!

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Monday, August 20, 2007 12:25:58 AM

I don't want you to be angry at me

I don't even know what to think about "Zeitgeist". But today I got a sign. My mother gave me a book, written from teh (

) Dalai Lama...

Safss_ali # Monday, August 20, 2007 12:42:11 AM

!
Now that's some sign!!!

Aniruddhakavishwar # Monday, August 20, 2007 1:16:26 AM

Yes that's it . Respect is inherent in tolerance.

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Monday, August 20, 2007 5:49:12 AM

argument is good but in a quiet manner... civilized... tolerant.
... who knows you might change your mind, if the argument is reasonable.

we must respect each other enough to allow even stubborness in another's viewpoint.

the whole world is in transition... there are labor pains.

i believe that if we choose our words carefully we can live in harmony in spite of differences of understanding.

ss-ali... i was so touched by your dismay at your cousin's atheism.
don't give up on him. study the proofs for the existence of god.
ask him if he created the universe.
ask him if the universe is lawful.
ask him if it is maintained.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Monday, August 20, 2007 6:24:27 PM

ArtMan. Are you waching?

I'm leaving for a few days in the mountains. Miss u all

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Monday, August 20, 2007 9:48:29 PM

i am watching... lucky you.
oh give me the mountains... oh take me to the high mountains.

Safss_ali # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 5:32:16 AM

Enjoy ur trip Arnek!

Don't worry, ArtMan the last debate I felt I had the upperhand (he made alot of mis-statements at the end). I'll probably be in a couple of other arguments with my cousin. I hv his younger brother who helps and backs me.

Ur right...hv to read up on some philosophy and critical thinking to improve my arguments and to know both sides. especially this richard dawkins guy's side...

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 6:06:26 AM

atheism is the godchild of existentialism, the misunderstanding of buddhism.
i was raised by a couple of atheists because they had inherited, both my parents, a popular idea, which the intelligentsia of the time found very freeing. little did they know.

i am convinced that no one really knows. but, that there is a spectacular mystery about existence itself, takes time served on earth to experience.

Aniruddhakavishwar # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 8:24:21 AM

Scott , have u read book "I M THAT" by Morrice. ?

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 8:32:55 AM

no. i assume you are recommending it.

just from the title i can see that i would be interested. i will make a note of it.

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 6:44:27 PM

Have a good trip

Safss_ali # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 7:03:52 PM

Wow, there's irony abt ur parents atheism and i guess ur theism. I just think it's a question of pride for my cousin. To hv to worship or believe there is something 'greater'.

Aniruddhakavishwar # Tuesday, August 21, 2007 9:43:08 PM

Scott , I have been watching ur comments. I m impressed by ur thought process. Hence I recomend the book. The book is a compilation of the question and answars and the discussions held by worldwide people with NISARGADATTA MHARAJ . Aniruddha

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Wednesday, August 22, 2007 12:15:10 AM

and i thank you for the gift aniruddha. i will order it.

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Wednesday, August 22, 2007 1:12:26 AM

i just spent an hour reading about nisargadatta. he seems genuine.
i am not against bhakti yoga. it is needed by many. and i very much liked his original approach... the ordinary man. the obyvatel as they say in russia.

that is the way i feel. not to be oversized, but to grow the essence. to concentrate on being is a swift way to freedom.

i will still order the book.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Sunday, August 26, 2007 6:27:47 PM

Dear friends. While i'ver been away, having a nice retreat, you have improved my blogg. Thank u all

WiseManArtMan: I just want to underline your words: There are labor pains. My thoughts too. They will increase i'm afraid, before something better is born. I'll like to recomend the danish philosophiser Soren Kiekegaard, the "father of existensialism". His thoughts about God and life are deep, but his life did'nt much follow his own teaching, like Gandhi or Nelson Mandela, and especially Jesus.
ali ss: will u b my friend?

Safss_ali # Sunday, August 26, 2007 6:53:15 PM

Sure Arnek. How was ur trip? Hope it was nice...

Fatimahzenya # Sunday, August 26, 2007 7:42:54 PM

Hi there again,

Ghandi was my hero and I draw from his strengths
and his weaknesses..

Thank you for showing me your blog

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Sunday, August 26, 2007 7:49:34 PM

He's back, yeeehaaaaa

Aniruddhakavishwar # Monday, August 27, 2007 4:09:50 AM

Whether any thought not supported with action have impact on others ?

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Monday, August 27, 2007 10:12:21 AM

I fear so, but hopefully not for a very long time, or it must include at lest parts of truth

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Monday, August 27, 2007 10:18:39 AM

Ali. My trip was very enjoyable, first alone, then shared with my wife.

E DEivindd # Tuesday, August 28, 2007 7:38:08 AM

As usual, many religions are used to keep people down. I am more concerned about how people are treated in the islamic world. Or where women are murdered because they live western style..

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Tuesday, August 28, 2007 7:51:53 AM

Yes ,but i do not like our tendency of asking non western worlds to practice our ideal of eg democracy, while we are getting less and less democratic ourselves. Eivindd did u know that the international community has condemned Norway for touture in their prisoning practice for many years, and we have still not changed our practice of unhumanly long solitary confinement before any proper trial, to soften up the prisoner

Safss_ali # Tuesday, August 28, 2007 4:21:28 PM

I don't think all women r killed living a western style!

But unfortunately some cultural or tribal vibe bubbles on 'honour' tht gets such families riled up...How on earth do they think their honour is restored by murder...??! I'm just glad it's now decreased in Pak(not b'coz of western culture, but simply on Heresay or luv marriages),with stronger sentences and better media coverage therefore some better justice.

Didn't Norway hv this dark secret of abused mixed Norwegian-German SS children after the 2nd world war? Their issue just recently went to court...did they ever get their apology...it was heart wrenching wht they had to go thru...am I mistaking this story with another country?

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Tuesday, August 28, 2007 7:31:45 PM

Those muslims are only a few. There are some catholics, too which kill in the name of "god" cause they see sins everywhere. Nearly every religion has those fundamentalistics (don't know if this is the right word)...

Safss_ali # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:40:46 AM

"Fundamentalistics"

I think tht'll catch on...!
Now's a good time to make ur strong point...play Zeitgeist to prove religion's a conspiracy!

StefanTeh H4mst0R # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:52:09 AM

If you know this and know that we are all the same (everyone has to eat, to drink, to pee and everyone has to shit)... How stupid is killing eachother? This is exactly what THEY want us to do. To hate eachother.
But not with me. I like you all. Here in the my.opera-community i found so many interesting people, just like Arne, hitesha, Leonard, Rea, Oana, Fatimah, Saf etc.
We are all just human beings. Make love not war.

Safss_ali # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:59:23 AM

eeeeewwwwwww...get away from me...don't make luv to me...!!!

Safss_ali # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:59:37 AM

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 7:09:43 AM

Ali U have heard right. But it was not much of a secret

and the governement has officially made an excuse, and many have got a symbolic compensation. Good

Safss_ali # Wednesday, August 29, 2007 3:20:55 PM

'ugh' at the pic!

Good to hear they did get an apology and some compensation...tht really is all wht most victims want.

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:55:26 AM

My dear friends

I'm starting a new blog. It is up to u to make my new blog a better blog filled with love. I miss some girls (opera is giving me troubble, or something

) Hopefully my friends will continue their good work on this blog, and the new blog will make it easier for new peoples to join. It is better to keep political statements on my old blog. To start off:
Fundamentalism: The enemies say that this is like intolerance. A fundamentalist would say that it means to take one owns religious scriptures seriously. I'll like to take the Bible seriously, and i think there are deep truths in most other religious books etc. Who can understand God, exept God

Arne K LundArnekrilu # Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:04:07 AM

My dear friends

I'm starting a new blog. It is up to u to make my new blog a better blog filled with love. I miss some girls (opera is giving me troubble, or something

scott cummingI_ArtMan # Friday, August 31, 2007 12:03:58 AM

so true... the bible itself says that god befuddles our mind. and that's his intention.

keep in touch old friend. like a link to the new blog. eh?

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