Political affiliates

Political affiliates

Just a mini poll to see which party people would vote for

Would this count as a duplicate of the "political spectrum" thread?

Independent isn't a party, hence that option should be "Other/undecided" (and yes, there are quite a few other parties, even if they have no chance of winning at this point).

Originally posted by sgunhouse:

Would this count as a duplicate of the "political spectrum" thread?

Note quite... since this asks about the political party of the US.

Originally posted by sgunhouse:

Independent isn't a party, hence that option should be "Other/undecided" (and yes, there are quite a few other parties, even if they have no chance of winning at this point).

Edited

I'm not sure if I'd vote for the Republicans until I know who their candidate is, so for now I'll have to say undecided. I consider myself a Libertarian, but usually end up voting for Republicans.

I personally will vote for anybody that has a legitimate chance to evict the present occupant of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave NW Washington, DC. PERIOD!

Realistically, that seems only to be the eventual candidate of the Republican Party.

No 3rd. Party candidate can realistically succeed in doing that. (Please don't give me that child's song about the Ant vs the Rubber Tree Plant to say they could).

Obama has but two (2) questionable legislative success stories (ObamaCare & The Stimulus) to show for his almost 4 years of Presidency, one of which------50%-----will fall to the curb in a short few days.

He's up to his eyeballs in an Olympic sized pool full of Alligators, & his six shooter only shoots blanks. Life Support would be optimistic

Barring finding enough voting dead, the weakness of his opponent may be his only hope for salvation once ObamaCare falls flat.

Well those not from the US have won the poll so let them get a chance to run the place rather than the big two carnivals.........

Originally posted by rjhowie:

Well those not from the US have won the poll so let them get a chance to run the place rather than the big two carnivals.........

Love the way you start counting votes 6 hours before the polls close, & declare a winner based on the low turnout!


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Ineptocracy
(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) — a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

I plan on either writing Ron Paul in, or voting for a Paul/Gary Johnson or Johnson/Paul ticket. Both would be on the LIBERTARIAN Party ticket.

Although much smaller in number, there are many 3rd Parties in the US.

The Prohibitionists and Socialists are -likewise- forces to reckoned with!

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Obama has but two (2) questionable legislative success stories (ObamaCare & The Stimulus) to show for his almost 4 years of Presidency, one of which------50%-----will fall to the curb in a short few days.

No, those are the only two that you've been in the least bit interested in looking at, mostly because of your outrage over them.

http://whattheheckhasobamadonesofar.com/

Originally posted by johnnysaucepn:

http://whattheheckhasobamadonesofar.com/

The PDF link was dead, but pressing I'm not impressed I started getting littlet snippets...After going through the first 6-7 I realized it was mostly programs to help offset the higher costs of his programs & policies. Small potatoes.....nothing of any real legitimate recourse.

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

The PDF link was dead, but pressing I'm not impressed I started getting littlet snippets...After going through the first 6-7 I realized it was mostly programs to help offset the higher costs of his programs & policies. Small potatoes.....nothing of any real legitimate recourse.

Whereas the Patriot Act is still a great success. Obama even extended it.

Originally posted by Frenzie:

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

The PDF link was dead, but pressing I'm not impressed I started getting littlet snippets...After going through the first 6-7 I realized it was mostly programs to help offset the higher costs of his programs & policies. Small potatoes.....nothing of any real legitimate recourse.

Whereas the Patriot Act is still a great success. Obama even extended it.

I don't see that he had any political choice in doing so, but it has saved lives at the expense of our freedoms, which always leaves a foul taste, but sometimes the alternative might just be fouler.

Eventually/hopefully it will right-itself, & be part of unfortunate history---with lessons learned.

Well Smileyfaze there have been plenty of items of corruption in your elctoral system to justify my poll comments! All sorts of irregularities so just as well Jaybro got out of Florida back up to Michigan?

As for thedawgfan, I am aware he is corrrct about third parties. but here they get to parliament,into city councils (often run them) and so on. Even get into a government coalition! However in the US of A they are very neatly shouldered out by the big two. It seems too that in a recent Gallop Po;; so many Americans are getting tired of the two-party control system they call themselves "Independent" but difficult being recognised more better. It is a disgrace that the Republicans and Democrats have carved up the political system along with their multi-million backers to the dtriment of more and more of the people who are realising this?

In a seperate Forum thread I said that the young now are more astute about how they are being controlled over there and the way the country is being run internally and equally about foreign policies. That is the reason so many find Dr Paul a welcome voice. To go further I do think that in a couple of generations there will be some ground changing matters in the USA because younger generations are very much aware of how freedoms and rights they thought were enshrined in their Constitution are hijacked by the Corporate who run the system. However if there is no reasonable radical change to the way things are this may eventually in those future generations lead to something worse. No-one in Imperial Russia after 1905 thought there would ever be radical change in the regime but it did. Years ago I said at a meeting I didn't think there would be anything similar in my time to the USSR. Young America must take up the torch and keep it lit to pass it on and get back to those things that were held dear before they were hi-jacked by the Corporate greed merchants and political illegitimates. So the hope must be in thedawgfan's generation and those that come after and determine the system must change and never give up on that. If there is no great change sometime in the future I do fear that when things start to bring down even further due to an underclass of many millions the alternative could be a lot worse and catastrophical.

"Stand fast in thew faith: quit you like men, be strong."

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

I don't see that he had any political choice in doing so, but it has saved lives at the expense of our freedoms, which always leaves a foul taste, but sometimes the alternative might just be fouler.

Nonsense.

Need I post the old quote from Ben Franklin about sacrificing liberty for security?
Unless you can post a verifiable link, I call bs on your bit about saving lives.
That's an old, over-whored quote from Sean Hannity and his other uber-far-rightists pals.

Originally posted by thedawgfan:

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

I don't see that he had any political choice in doing so, but it has saved lives at the expense of our freedoms, which always leaves a foul taste, but sometimes the alternative might just be fouler.

Nonsense.

Need I post the old quote from Ben Franklin about sacrificing liberty for security?
Unless you can post a verifiable link, I call bs on your bit about saving lives.
That's an old, over-whored quote from Sean Hannity and his other uber-far-rightists pals.

I'm actually in fact agreeing with you to a degree, but I'm leaving an open mind as to the unknown & unprovable factors that maybe, the Patriot Act might have saved lives. That cell that was uncovered that planned gassing the Manhattan IND subway line that never got reported, or the cell that planned to bomb the Empire State Building...that never happened, so would the MSM have made it public that due to unreleased methods the FBI used to uncover the plot, but wouldn't make it public that it did for reasons of security (not letting the terrorists know it's methodology)?

How many lives must the Patriot Act need to save in order to be successful, & would it's success (if in fact we could verify that it did) warrant it's existence?

Would 10 lives over 10 years be too little? How about 250 then? How about 25,000?

Well, lets say just two (2)----yours & mine----would that be enough?

Subtract one from that equation (keep that to yourself 'cuz I don't wanna know ).......would that be enough?

Closing the mind to the possibility(s) does not prove a point one way or another, but I do agree with you that Ben Franklin did say what he did, & on the other hand would he say exactly the same today confronted with 2012 World realities?

We can surmise, but in fact, we will never know. Will we?

But, on the other side of the coin, what if we did know?

Hm. Wonder who's "affiliate" Horncastle would be…

@SF: I can respect your stance on the matter to a point, as it is all about protecting the country, but I stand on the side of Liberty.
I hope you can understand why.

Originally posted by thedawgfan:

....I can respect your stance on the matter to a point, as it is all about protecting the country, but I stand on the side of Liberty.
I hope you can understand why.

I do, & so do I.....except I will do my very best to ensure that the present occupant of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. is evicted in November, & hitting the bricks shortly thereafter.



I hope you can understand that I too stand on the side of Liberty & Freedom, & that I'm willing to meaningfully do something about it.

Here's some more guidance for you, SF.

One of the things I find funny about that article is the array of photographs. Note the only person that is smiling. Psychology in action!

Originally posted by string:

Here's some more guidance for you, SF.

One of the things I find funny about that article is the array of photographs. Note the only person that is smiling. Psychology in action!

God bless Dr. Paul, a true Patriot, a thoroughly honest American, & a straight shooter.

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

I hope you can understand that I too stand on the side of Liberty & Freedom, & that I'm willing to meaningfully do something about it.

*nods*

I leave you with this quote: "All we ask is to be let alone." -Jefferson Davis

What an excellent sentiment........

Originally posted by thedawgfan:

*nods*I leave you with this quote: "All we ask is to be let alone." -Jefferson Davis

That only works if you already have liberty.

That attitude results in liberty for some, but not liberty for all.

Originally posted by johnnysaucepn:

That only works if you already have liberty. That attitude results in liberty for some, but not liberty for all.

If you wouldn't mind, could you please be so kind as to define Liberty in your own words....not the textbook/dictionary regurgitated version.

Your personal perceptions would be appreciated.

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Originally posted by johnnysaucepn:

That only works if you already have liberty. That attitude results in liberty for some, but not liberty for all.

If you wouldn't mind, could you please be so kind as to define Liberty in your own words....not the textbook/dictionary regurgitated version.

Your personal perceptions would be appreciated.

Well, in my own words, I define Liberty as a small sort of mammal, a bit like a kiwi bird but with pangolin feet.

What kind of a question is that? What's the point of defining such terms in a 'personal' fashion - the whole point of a definition is to make sure we're all on the same page.

Like it or not, many people out there are restricted, or controlled, by circumstances beyond those imposed by the government. It's a complete fallacy to see government as the imposer of control and the enemy of liberty.

Originally posted by johnnysaucepn:

It's a complete fallacy to see government as the imposer of control and the enemy of liberty.

Well, a corrupt, tyrannical, monarchical government in the late 1700's enabled the birth of American Liberty because, using your words, it was the imposer of control, & the enemy of Liberty.

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Well, a corrupt, tyrannical, monarchical government in the late 1700's enabled the birth of American Liberty because, using your words, it was the imposer of control, & the enemy of Liberty.

Yes. Your point being?

What a load of midden (trash to ex-Colonists) from Smileyfaze. What replaced us was a local upper class of money men who have ran the place ever since whilst giving elections to keep the chidren happy and think they are free and have rights. It's history since that wonderful revolution giving such encouragement to the world is what? In fact it has been a long litany of upper class control just caustic money men, lack of rights and having to fight for them ever since the revolution. Look at the history of big cities and criminally run, and widespread criminal sydnicates. Extensions west and did the Indians in during the process and the ones not exterminated were criminally treated on truces and worse. Ethnic cleansing, death camps, racial fighting, corruption. Did someone say that even Illinois wass only 4th in the State corruption league?

Indeed the time before the Revolution is like a Sunday School to what came after. It was even the monied background people who did the Tea Party farce. When it comes to bare-faced corruption it is so intringient part of the USA it is a damn nerve to try and show somehow the Colonial time was worse. You people are experts in hypocrisy, corruption, creating was, wanting to dominate. Hell you could only get a third of the population to rally round the revolution!

I see that not being from the US has won by a landslide.

Yep, & only 4 Americans have posted to say anything one way or another.

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Yep, & only 4 Americans have posted to say anything one way or another.

You know what this calls for? We have to sing the nat'l anthem so as to get under Mr. Howie's skin.
ARE YOU READY SF? Here we go!

Originally posted by rjhowie:

Hell you could only get a third of the population to rally round the revolution!

And yet we defeated the world's greatest military power…

Originally posted by OakdaleFTL:

Originally posted by rjhowie:

Hell you could only get a third of the population to rally round the revolution!

And yet we defeated the world's greatest military power…

I didn't know you were Vietnamese!

Originally posted by string:

Originally posted by OakdaleFTL:

Originally posted by rjhowie:

Hell you could only get a third of the population to rally round the revolution!

And yet we defeated the world's greatest military power…

I didn't know you were Vietnamese!

As long as we're getting historic, let's go back a bit farther. Don't forget the barbarians who brought down Rome.

Originally posted by mjmsprt40:

As long as we're getting historic, let's go back a bit farther. Don't forget the barbarians who brought down Rome.

Exactly - I just thought it was all getting a bit silly.

Originally posted by string:

I didn't know you were Vietnamese!

Are you saying that Parliament lost what we call "The Revolutionary War" in much the same way our Congress lost Vietnam? (There's more truth to that than many know!)

Originally posted by OakdaleFTL:

Originally posted by string:

I didn't know you were Vietnamese!

Are you saying that Parliament lost what we call "The Revolutionary War" in much the same way our Congress lost Vietnam? (There's more truth to that than many know!)

Now there's a thought; wars are lost as much by shear administrative stupidity as valour, and rarely by the justice of the cause. But I was not being serious but just trying to deflect the debate a bit.

Originally posted by string:

But I was not being serious but just trying to deflect the debate a bit.

And I appreciate it! Still, were the "justice of the cause" decisive war would be unnecessary… No?
A snippet:

The English Whigs and George III. For all practical purposes, the real talent of Parliament stood in opposition to the policies of George III. Edmund Burke, who combined oratory and philosophy; Chatham, who had created an empire and lived to see its disintegration; John Wilkes, the king's anathema; Charles James Fox, glorying in his brittle brilliance; and a whole galaxy of English Whigs mocked and denounced the king for his colonial policies. Though unable to prevent his undertaking these policies, they limited the king's ability to mount the war effort necessary to subdue the colonials.
(source)

This tallies with what I remember reading in original sources and early histories…

Originally posted by thedawgfan:

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Yep, & only 4 Americans have posted to say anything one way or another.

You know what this calls for? We have to sing the nat'l anthem so as to get under Mr. Howie's skin.
ARE YOU READY SF? Here we go!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAYPN-1Yjt0

After hearing that, & reading your post, I think if he just clicks on this link he surely will have a brain hemorrhage! A Taste of Southern Hospitality courtesy of Ole Hickory

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Originally posted by thedawgfan:

Originally posted by Smileyfaze:

Yep, & only 4 Americans have posted to say anything one way or another.

You know what this calls for? We have to sing the nat'l anthem so as to get under Mr. Howie's skin.
ARE YOU READY SF? Here we go!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAYPN-1Yjt0

After hearing that, & reading your post, I think if he just clicks on this link he surely will have a brain hemorrhage! A Taste of Southern Hospitality courtesy of Ole Hickory

for an excellent choice.

can't wait to see his response to that.

It would take more than an over-hyped ex-Colonial lot of brainwashed yakking about the greatest country, army or whatever to get under my skin. Not even Edinburgers, Papists, SNP-ers can do that so why should let a nation that acts like a gormless crowd of children?. Always bemusing how selective Americans are about military matters. Vietnam yes was a bigger mess than the corporate led-American revolution. We had the wise sense to refuse to get involved. And the world's greatest fighting force (of course shouted by the lot across the pond had half a million men and did what? Tried generally to fight a tradtional style against jungle warriors and had to make a fast dash out with tails between legs. Got bogged down in Korea, landed in Somalia with the ever great Marines with cameras rolling as they swept in with the gung-ho stuff. However they left in a more quite un-successgful way that wasn't highlighted by the media. Came into the First World War when it was nearing an end and as usual stormed in with all that gung-ho and got slaughtered brutally just like the longer term combatants. They thought they were going to show everyone something different and found it not so. Second WW2 Dragged it's heels of course coming in.

Now look at that cartoon put up here by thedawgfan.

-One nation. Oh yeah racially divided for almost as long as it existed and those that led the 'great republic' were determined to keep ascendancy. Apart from telling that to negroes, include the native Indians as well. Then there were those not allowed the vote - skin again. Things were so unfair it led to a civil war in the 'one nation'.
-Liberty and Justice for all (!). The history is full of contradictions and downright falsehood. For over two centuries Americans have had to fight for basic rights and freedoms in their own country. There is a racial fault line in that they belief this keech even though the internal history tells you something else. Even today freedoms and rights are being whittled away and if not battered to a pulp by a macho uniformed lot pretending to be police. Apart from the farce of a would-be political thing it is the same with the legal system as well. All the great sounding words hide the fact that you have to have money to have "rights".

There isn't a proper electoral system at all. Smaller parties have no chance becuase the big two carve things up so they have not a chance in Hell. Big money runs the country that is why the financial resources control have shrunk in control down to 1%. The gap is wider in the land of the free and home of the brave than any time in it's history. All that grim faced would-be patriotism and near tears on the flag that has created wars and mayhem all over the Earth in the warped name of spreading freedom and democracy. The vast majority over there cannot see in their childish idea of politics that they could do with themselves! More spy agencies all spying on the poor fools and each other as I indicated a couple of years back more of such than the Third Reich! Well I suppose to be fair you did learn something from WW2. Not satisfied with corrupting the country and it's nose lead citizenry they spread corruption and trouble everywhere. Now it is pawned to a damn dictatorship regarding Communist China! Good gried you even cannot find a sttaesman President to run the place either!

You lot can believe all the nonsense and breast beating you make but the normal, sensible folk elsewhere see the historical world terror it creates and the flag represents today in 2012 illustrates the most militant, two-faced instigator of actions that are far removed from all that stuff in that wee bit of paper composed by your money aristcoracy over two centuries ago and have fooled you ever since. Hey, I wouldn't want to get up American noses for reminding of the truth the rest of the world sees!!

Well that is one nose well and truly got up!

Incidentally, that song that SF posted was very popular in the UK many, many years ago. I did not know it was a "Southern" song, but then Southern battle songs are great. I remember an evening in New Orleans .....

Jingoism has a mixture of origins, largely false, and is itself a thing that is only tolerable with a sense of humour, and that goes for every country.

Originally posted by rjhowie:

......Hey, I wouldn't want to get up American noses for reminding of the truth the rest of the world sees!!

......... ....

................................................


All they wanted was an Opportunity in America. Nothing else.

America gave them their Opportunity, & then the millions upon millions took it from there.

Today with their heads up high---they are proud Americans, proud to call America home, & proud of what America has become, & ever thankful for the first Opportunity.........the promise that was kept & then some. They all say in unison......who gives a rats ass what the world thinks or what the world thinks it sees,,,,,,,Oh, America-----Home Sweet Home!

Originally posted by string:

I did not know it was a "Southern" song, but then Southern battle songs are great. I remember an evening in New Orleans .....

Yes indeed, it is String.

Mission accomplished SF!
Incidentally SF, when Mr. Howie writes his novels, do you imagine the following clip going on, as I do?

Yep, its all just a jumbled mess of incoherent

Oh dear, Smileyfaze only confirming my onslaught! Big, brash and a load of baloney. Yeah tell it to the tens of millions starving and homeless in the land of the free and home of the brave. And most appropriate to have political style cartoon insertions as the comic cuts which passes for an electoral system and politics in the ex-Colonies is one awfully big laugh for us all in the normal world. As it happens thedawgfan knows only too well the corrupting inhouse sewn up situ by the big 2 on the 'Hill means he and many others are frozen out. Smileyfaze for an intelligent man you illustrate the worse worlf face of the US of A. Of course as I pointed out such people don't care a damn what anyone thinks because you think the world is yours and your plaything. The hardest thing to accept is that you will diminish in time and one day there may be a more constructive currency than the pawnbroker dollar and eejits thinking they are the Audie Murphies of the world. You still don't get it after all that yabadabadoo about how great you are that you only exist thanks to Communist China! Ha, ha, gee, what a place! Yakking about freedom and democracy but the Commies keeping you afloat! As it happens Southern laddie, there is a numbered limited cirulation book (a copy is in the Mitchell Reference Library here) and has a whole chapter on yours truly and I was personally interviewed by the author. So you lot will be a dot in time and I will be around always for the future to read about!

Originally posted by rjhowie:

Oh dear, Smileyfaze only confirming my onslaught! ......... a load of baloney .....hissyfit....................................baloney..............................................cry...............................................hiss....................................baloney.......................................................spit..................hissyfit...............................baloney........................spit...................................................baloney......................................................sputter...................................................baloney.........................katooie...............................hissyfit........................hemorrhage...............hemorrhage.............................slither................hemorrhage........................baloney...............hemorrhage............yadda....yadda....yadda..... ... ... ... ...

Wake me when rj says somethin' new &/or important.......

Originally posted by jax:

I see that not being from the US has won by a landslide.

made me smile

The Republican candidates this time are so extremely absurd that I almost want to vote against them rather than for who I want. But I will try to stiffen my spine and vote for who I want. And I hope that most people do that. Voting 'against' is weak - it can be a paving stone on the road to hell.

Well talk about the pot calling the kettle black there smileyfaze! You do not a bad job of repeat jobs from your own corner. Bad enough rather dopey Republican candidates but that I have to see the same opinion from the would-be Democrat hanger-on, Jaybro in elsewhere, shows the futility is nationwide! Thank goodness I am 3,000 miles from the kindergarten!