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Though if you want to be technical about it - as you didn't specify that one species was human, you could be talking about mules (which are the result of breeding a donkey with a horse) and similar creatures. I think people would consider the other discussion as too offensive.
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
I didn't say there were. That doesn't change the fact that ability to consent should work for children, mentally handicapped people, animals, unknown future developments, and everything I didn't explicitly mention.Legally, no other species is known to be able to consent.
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
Legally, no other species is known to be able to consent.
I once knew a parrot who...never mind.
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
... mules (which are the result of breeding a donkey with a horse)...
That is relevant. What breeding practices should be legal or not, and why?
Should breeders consider how the female feels about the whole thing? (y) (n)
I think so. (y) But from what I've seen of breeders; lots of them look on their stock as if they were machines.
But that also applies to same-species mating. Is species more important than sex?
Originally posted by Horncastle:
There was a posh discussion in the tea-room here about when a foal should be considered a stallion. .
I mentioned 'when he's larger than 2 hands'. .
Everyone looked at me strangely. .
How many have been sexually attacked(?) by a randy mutt/dog/man's best friend (And possibly woman's too) ?.
Originally posted by Belfrager:
It seems to happen that, in remote areas, lonely shepherds knows their sheep... well... too well.
lol, Yep, the Welsh are well known for that; being sheep-shaggers and whatnot.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
"Americans should not go abroad to slay dragons they do not understand in the name of spreading democracy." -President John Quincy Adams
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
Legally, no other species is known to be able to consent.
It looks like if he was waiting for a consent
Every morning a lion wakes up. It knows it must outrun the slowest gazelle or it will starve to death.
It doesn't matter whether you are a lion or a gazelle: when the sun comes up, you'd better be running.
18. May 2012, 20:59:30 (edited)
.....
Help!
When I previewed the above gif, it showed just fine, but when I posted it, only the link showed. Anybody, anybody.....?!
19. May 2012, 06:14:00 (edited)
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
Legally, no other species is known to be able to consent.
Incorrect wording. In some jurisdictions, legally, no other species is defined as able to consent. We know that "legal" does not always equate with "factual".
Originally posted by sgunhouse:
Consent requires the ability to understand, no other species is known to be able to understand. (And likewise we presume minors can't really understand.) Though in some cases, maybe it's just that we don't understand them well enough.
No other species understands? WTF?
Understand what???
I would say that honest consent requires the ability to understand the consequences of saying yes or no. But in the case of interspecies sex there are no consequences, are there? Except maybe "having a good time" and that isn't so much a consequence as it is a goal.
That depends on whether "having a good time" produces the consequences of an offspring, Which could be so wrong on so many levels, Even lab scientists could end up in a state of shock.
Originally posted by aefields:
I would say that honest consent requires the ability to understand the consequences of saying yes or no.
I think the appropriate term is "informed consent".
And on that level, the species barrier is pretty much a side-issue. When it comes to human relationships - with whatever - we demand that informed consent be given. However it seems that practicality trumps free will when it comes to livestock breeding, and that the health of the animals is the primary concern and objection.
Originally posted by LinuxMint7:
@ aefields
That depends on whether "having a good time" produces the consequences of an offspring, Which could be so wrong on so many levels, Even lab scientists could end up in a state of shock.
Well, maybe if we were back in the legendary times of the ancient greeks that would be important.
(I assume you're talking about something more bizarre than a mule from horse and donkey)
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Did any human ever try to impregnate a chimp or vice versa?
Certainly
FNORD14. Wipe thine ass with what is written and grin like a ninny at what is Spoken. Take thine refuge with thine wine in the Nothing behind Everything, as you hurry along the Path.
THE PURPLE SAGE, HBT; The Book of Predictions, Chap. 19
Originally posted by johnnysaucepn:
... it seems that practicality trumps free will when it comes to livestock breeding, and that the health of the animals is the primary concern and objection.
True. And that is an important consideration.
If free will and consent are important in one area, then why aren't they important in other areas? (And the inverse: if these values are not important when considering breeding and butchering, how can they be important when considering pleasant things?)
Me, I think the judgement should be upon whether both parties are happy. Happy at the time, and happy in the future. If nothing bad comes of it, then it isn't bad.
However... on a side branch... I just can't force myself to be vegetarian. Meat is yummy.
One can't really criticize a leopard for killing and eating whatever it wants. Right?Originally posted by ensbb3:
After experiencing sex you don't need much understanding to know if you want some or not. And let us not forget there was a time you would marry your daughter off while she was in her early teens. Children's experience nowadays is held back because there's no need to have them producing babies asap given most all have good survival odds. Sex is more often now for the sake of pleasure alone. What may be missing in our understanding is that why animals have sex isn't so different. We and they are wired to enjoy it. It's not like they are only in it to procreate. That would be a human, and mostly religious, idea. With no incentive there's no babies, they lack the understanding to know they need to mix some DNA. The consequences are what nature intended them to be... for the most part.
Well put.
Originally posted by OnetimePoster:
I don't think we should encourage interspecies same-sex marriage.
Wait, I though homospecies marriage was already allowed?
Originally posted by rjhowie:
You are probably right OnetimePoster. If aliensd ever landed you can bet that johnnysaucepn with a concerned look will be waving the rainbow flag at them and looking after their rights in that regard.
Sure. Because that's likely to be something that ever crosses my mind. Sorry, I'm not quite as obsessed with the subject as you appear to be.
Originally posted by rjhowie:
Ha, ha, and you are trying to be so serious are you? I don't ever remember you avoiding the issue. Irony, irony! Any time I come in on it you get all minced up.
Exactly. And you do seem to talk about it an awful lot, don't you?
Originally posted by OnetimePoster:
My goat will be saddened by your bigotry.I don't think we should encourage interspecies same-sex marriage.
Originally posted by rjhowie:
You are probably right OnetimePoster. If aliensd ever landed you can bet that johnnysaucepn with a concerned look will be waving the rainbow flag at them and looking after their rights in that regard.
And this is your idea of making a point?
Originally posted by rjhowie:
That's really, really rich. Coming from someone who likes to think himself satirical on many "points" on these forums time after time. So it's okay for you but not someone else. How revealingly arrogant. Time for you to take a self assessment.
Well, ok, I want to know: what IS your point?
Originally posted by aefields:
Well, ok, I want to know: what IS your point?
Apparently, I'm all about the hawt exo-erotica. When in fact, I'm all in favour of staying as far away from it as possible.
Originally posted by rjhowie:
Well I have made it aefields but I cannot help your grey cells mature.
It is not a question of grey matter (intelligence). It is a matter of language. Communication failure. Sometimes one has to make one's point in several different ways. Yeah, it's annoying that one has to, but there it is.