Opera should not show international version as default as its download size is much larger

Opera should not show international version as default as its download size is much larger

If anyone goes to opera.com it takes to this page or this homepage.

In both the cases, the user gets to download international version (6.3 MB) and opera does not mention anything in the startup page about even existence of any other versions. Unless someone clicks to download link.

In my opinion, this is unnecessarily gives wrong information of big installer size of opera. Secondly, also does not highlight multi-platform, multi-language support of opera. Also it gives opportunity to some people like this guy to put wrong info in his review of opera where he says opera file size is 6.17MB and firefox 4.6 MB. He quotes "While downloading the latest versions of Opera and Firefox; I noticed that Opera’s installer size was larger than Firefox. There was a comment saying that they both were the same but I will argue that Firefox 1.5.0.4 is 4.9MB while Opera 9 is 6.17MB. This comes as no surprise to me, as I just wanted to make sure I have accurate data on here."

This is how wrong myths against opera circulates. We should not give the chance for such.

So, My suggestion is to direct user from any startup (may be advertising rich fancy page) to the download page where he can have the option to choose and same time the default selection will be 4.6MB version.


Well, it might sound very unimportant but I feel it something worth consideration.

If you use an English language version (of Opera at least), the English installer is selected by default.

If you use a different language, you will probably want to download the international installer anyway.

I think the Classic installer should be a little more prominent in the listing.

Originally posted by haavard:

If you use an English language version (of Opera at least), the English installer is selected by default.

If you use a different language, you will probably want to download the international installer anyway.

Hi Haavard,
You are assuming that I am accessing opera.com by using opera browser. but, what i pointed out that someone new will likely to access with another browser, say IE. he will always get the international installer and prompted to download 6.3 MB. At that point the new user is unlikely to even know about existence of anything else.
So, my suggestion was to take to the download page where english and international are listed next to each other. Easy for the user to see the 4.6MB small file size of opera that we always feel proud of.

Originally posted by operafan2006:

someone new will likely to access with another browser, say IE. he will always get the international installer and prompted to download 6.3 MB

wrong. if the browser language is set to "en" the english version is always downloaded. (proof)
however, it seems that we currently don't recognize english language settings such as "en-us", "en-gb", etc.. and we should fix that.

Well that might be the case. I have windows xp in en-US installed and accessed via IE6. it always showed me international version.
Yes, opera should fix that as early as possible otherwise guys like that reviewer is spreding wrong message.

The Classic installer is an even smaller download.

what is the fundamental difference between the two?
I don't know the very technical thing but I heard that msi is more friendly to windows systems.

I see MSI as more limited.

The Classic installer allows me to install in any location, to upgrade or as a clean installation as I wish.

The MSI installer gives you a limited choice of where to install. It integrates into Windows better, or so I am led to understand. It has better support to install over a network and of course the language support.

MSI also allows you to install to any location.

Now I see that opera recognizes en-US if I visit opera site using opera browser. Thats good for me and other opera user.
bad news is, opera could not detect IE7 in en-US . I tried to visit opera.com with IE7 and it took me to 6.27MB download.

I repeatedly mentioning this because in many place in the web, I found opera fie size is mis-represented as 6.3(larger than firefox). it is creating bad impression.
Please do something about it.

update is that opera.com is again messed up. no matter what browser I use, opera/IE in en-US, opera prompts for 6.3MB international version.

Please stop this annoyance which causing bad impression all over the web. I don't need this fancy auto detection. Take to to a download page with option to choose version and platform.

Originally posted by operafan2006:

I don't need this fancy auto detection.

Then you can of course choose to set options manually on the download page.

Take to to a download page with option to choose version and platform.

That would complicate things for everyone else. We need to make the download work as smoothly as possible, and that means not forcing the user to set all kinds of options.

Haavard, I personally can go through any steps to download my suitable version of opera. But what i am trying to make a point is about misleading info about opera's file size. Autodetect is smart but it is fancy when it does not work.
Taking to a download page with simple dropdown or just listed version both international and english should be fine. I don't understand whats point prompting user to download international version without even exposing to him the existence of anything else? Why One user visiting site using IE7(en_US) should be promptedfor international version?

Anyway, please look into this from the opera's impression of file size point of view. I don't think a page like opera's download(http://www.opera.com/download/) is too complicated? Just slick either one.

Originally posted by operafan2006:

But what i am trying to make a point is about misleading info about opera's file size. Autodetect is smart but it is fancy when it does not work.

Then the solution is to fix the auto-detection, not to make the download process more complicated

A temporary (or permamnant) fix can be keep the auto detect on for anyone visiting site using opera and for anyone visiting with IE/FF prompt for smaller file size. Those will be new users!

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying, but here's how it should work:

If you are using an English version of your browser, you should get the English MSI package. If you are not using an English version (or at least if you are using one of the available languages), you should get the International MSI package.

currently it did not work for using en-US. So, it might be case for other english versions as well. In that case its not giving correct impression. So I proposed if you can't make sure it works with all english version, you might consider showing them smaller file instead of larger one. thats what I mentioned.


Moreover, anyone using opera, he might be using in either languages and its fine to detect his version english or not. But for IE/FF user, the case may be different. So, for those why not show them smaler one or at least showthem two just like in download page.

Anyway, I think I tried to make the point of creating wrong conception about opera file size. Now, its finally yours judgement. Sticking to current method is not working for whatever reasons. So, it might worth considering showing the both as in the downloadpage(http://www.opera.com/download/). I think it is not much work for user in the page above.

it still does not work for en-US. It shows international version.

On every machine where I install Opera, I go directly to the download page. I see no complication there. This could be the main download page for new Opera users IMO.

edit: forget my comment, I didn't read the first post and tought you meant the /download/ page

I agree it should be fixed on the front page...

hi Stein, thaks for your note. Please look into the matter as early as possible. Opera's autodetection and showing appropriate version is smart way. But it is of no use if it does not work. Thats why I asked for showing directly the download page or showing the options listed in the same page to let user choose.

Anyway, not for debate but I want this to be fixed . Please.

I just noticed today, problem is still not fixed.

So, its just taken for granted that opera can't fix this and en-US users is not on the list of opera as users!

Originally posted by operafan2006:

en-US users is not on the list of opera as users!

A working Opera for everyone is better than a smaller but unusable (for users don't read English) Opera in English.

I agree the frontpage shall be fixed, or Opera Software may build installers that can download language packs on the fly. Before that, downloading international version is a acceptable workaround.

What I was asking as temporary work around or perhaps even a better choice is to take to the download page where user will have all the option in the world(english,international,classic)

Taking people to the download page would make the download process more complicated.

Originally posted by haavard:

Taking people to the download page would make the download process more complicated.

Isn't just one more extra click is better than any annoyance, misconception? Moreover, when it is able to demostrate all flexible versions of opera in one page, it should be the natural choice.
Anyway, I can only hope, opera gives it a realistic thought rather than some ideal,so called smart way.

I simply don't understand whats the confusion/problem/hard work if any, when people is taken to download page and see in clear eyes the options available. The download page has it all in very straight forward way:
you have three installers(english,classic,international), you have link to "language files" just below it, you have link to "other versions/platforms may be" right there, you have opera mini/mobile links, you have top menu bar with all nice links specially support there. It is just about the perfect thing.

Not everyone is a power user who wants these choices. The point of the splash page is to make it easy to download Opera, and to focus on getting the product. Choices can be made if the user wants to, but he shouldn't be forced to.

Originally posted by haavard:

Not everyone is a power user who wants these choices. The point of the splash page is to make it easy to download Opera, and to focus on getting the product. Choices can be made if the user wants to, but he shouldn't be forced to.

I understand the purpose of the big green button. But just one extra click(clicking green to download page) is not a big deal when it can minimize many other small annoyances/problems etc.

With due respect Haavard, showing the choices is not forcing them and its just opposite. if you think of average users, they will not even know the existence of any other version until they see download page. All they know of opera is from the "big green button" in the front page. So, the power users rather knows many ways to handle this and I am not at all talking about them.

In fact, in the current way, you are forcing user to use international version just for a 200 kB language file. This could have been done otherwise(thats debatable I agree). May be I don't use opera's language, I can use some other unofficial language! But still auto detection will only give me international version! But when aupt detection fails, it will even show en-US users the international file.

Please consider this. I believe it might annoy us(older users) but new users will feel better. In my some other posts, I also mentioned of streamlined access to opera resources. In the menu tabs of download page, I think buttons should be places=d for "opera customizations/add-ons" as well. So that like mozilla, users at first appearance, knows the xistence of such things. Thats off-topic. But I mentioned here in the context of importance of a well designed download page from eye-catching splash page.

Haavard, I request you to kindly give your valuable thought on the whole thing. May be I am wrong on some, but overall, things can be better placed.

As I've mentioned before, the right fix is to offer the English installer to English speaking users, not to make the download process more complicated. And until it is fixed, I'm afraid you will just have to put up with everyone getting the international installer

Originally posted by haavard:

And until it is fixed, I'm afraid you will just have to put up with everyone getting the international installer

Thanks. May be you and me have different definition of "complicated" when comes to the download page issue!
I was not concerned with me at all as I could download opera from anywhere. My concern was mostly for new users and the over all impression of opera. Thats why spent time to talk about it but finally disappointed that I could make you all understand the need.

Anyway, I will feel lucky to see it fixed but don't know when it will be, if at all(doubt comes from the date of this thread).

Thanks for pointing that. Many in this forum and outside get confused with opera files size. In cnet.com, opera is showed as 6.3MB in the download section. I saw in several places people saying opera is larger compared to firefox!

and how many more confused users(like Tarnak) will opera lose, before it is 'fixed'?? ( I include CNET in this!!! )

If the 'download' button went to http://www.opera.com/download/ , that would help them a lot...

I get the English version on the front page with IE7. What are you all talking about?

... and is that 4.7 Mb or 3.9 MB??? -it could just be they have fixed the 'recognition' for language...

(international is 6.1Mb BTW..)

Originally posted by nelsson:

I get the English version on the front page with IE7. What are you all talking about?

If your language is set to en-US, then you will not get english version(if you read beginning posts in this thread).

same until today!

Originally posted by Saddle Magic:

I see MSI as more limited. The Classic installer allows me to install in any location, to upgrade or as a clean installation as I wish.

I agree completely, while MSI is a nice enough tool for network administrators for network deployment it is not as useful to standard users.

Originally posted by operafan2006:

If your language is set to en-US, then you will not get english version(if you read beginning posts in this thread).

Works fine here with "en-US" both in Opera and IE.

Originally posted by Turin:

while MSI is a nice enough tool for network administrators for network deployment it is not as useful to standard users.

Sure it is. It's just a normal installer. Normal users will find is as useful as any other installer.

Originally posted by nelsson:

Works fine here with "en-US" both in Opera and IE.

Nelsson, it works sometimes. But you you check back some other time, its is not. If you see my post date, I am kind of tracking it but it is simply not the best reliable thing 99% time. If they fixed it recently, I don't know.

This does not work again as I just checked right now with opera9.5 us-en. From opera.com webpage when clicked download, it prompted to download international version.
Also tried with IE7 in winxpsp2 platform, it prompted to download international version of 6.27MB size.

My question is if you can't deliver it right with automatic detection, whats the point of having it? Why not simply take to download page?

I simply does not buy the idea of avoiding one extra click. For a new user why should he download bigger 6.27 when he has option for classic or msi installers of smaller size? At least he should know that those exists and leave for his judgement that what he wants.

I am sorry to report back here that The problem still apears as the latest opera 9.5 arrived. I tried with both opera and IE 7, I still got the international version. With increased dowload size of 8.6MB in internation version, the impression is worse than ever before.
I would reiterate my previous post "... if you can't deliver it right with automatic detection, whats the point of having it? Why not simply take to download page? "

Doesn't anybody wonder why anyone in this thread seems te be located in the US

You should learn that most people don't speak your language natively.

But anyway, I really wonder WHY the int. version is so much bigger. The lang files are not so big. And compressed, they should get quite small...

Uhm... little question: is it still larger than Firefox? As i see now Opera 9.5 for Mac is a 15.6mb download (international, that is the only one aviable for Mac) while the mono language version of Firefox is 16.8mb. That looks quite good to me, especially after installation, where Firefox uses 47mb vs Opera's 34mb. Plus the space for settings in both cases...

Actually this (9.50 release) was the first time since 9.0 that I was taken to the download page with English msi installer already chosen, which was the correct version. Previously it was always that in a few second of clicking "Download" button, the international version would start to download and I had to cancel and go to alternative download page to choose English msi. This was despite I've always used English classic (earlier) or msi (since 9.2 & and primary web language [en] (+ secondary [ja]).

Originally posted by Hades32:

Doesn't anybody wonder why anyone in this thread seems te be located in the US

I don't think so. Operafan and Saddle are in US, but the rest are all over the world. Tamil's even in Heaven! Also non-English speakers do not necessarily want localised version. (I'm Japanese but when I learnt to use PC it was all English, so I prefer English UI.)

I agree fully with mimi_s_mum,

I am a czech, except Czech, I speak German, English, Spanish. Most information on the web I find in these languages. My browser was always set to English and now to Spanish. I use only the classic installer. I am an advanced user, even not such advandced as tamil or some of you, I had problems to find 9.5 classic installer!!! The structure of download-possibilies doesn't make any sence for me.

Most users are able to read and they have some kind of brain. Let them deside, which version is the correct one for them.

I really don't need 33 langueges in the installer. Nobody needs them!